Why Mindfulness Works
Speaker 0: You're listening to Takeout Therapy. I'm your host, Rebecca Hunter. I'm a private practice therapist, an anxiety specialist who's doing things differently. In about twenty minutes, I'm here to teach you how to deal with an everyday difficult element of life in a healthier way. This podcast is unscripted, totally unedited.
Just my straight up advice from years of experience. This is not therapy. It's just personal growth for people in a hurry for change. So let's get to work. Hello, hello, my friend.
Thanks for joining me today. Hey, so based on last week's episode on Stonewalling, I thought it would be fun to rerun an older episode that I did on another factor that totally damagers are beautiful healthy loving relationships. And that, my friend, is defensiveness. Today, I hope you enjoy listening to this short episode that we'll talk about what defensiveness does in our relationships, whether it's our family relationships, our romantic relationships, our friendships. And what we can do to kind of open up to the possibility of getting some feedback and working with the people that we've chosen to be in relationship as opposed to working against them.
So this goes along the same theme as last week. If you're looking a little bit closer at your relationships, I hope this episode helps you out tremendously. I'll see you again soon. Thanks for listening. Hello, my friends.
I come to you today fresh off of a nice, robust argument with my husband, which is a great setup for today's episode about defensiveness. You know, it's interesting in my work because what I see as a pervasive problem in many relationships. And even my own at times, is this defensiveness that we have really against each other. And when we are defensive and we feel that we need to defend our position, which by the way, is like a human thing, not a dysfunctional thing. We all get defensive.
But what happens and the problem with it that I want to talk with you about today is that defensiveness keeps us disconnected from each other. So here's the deal with humans. We're just inherently defensive. We get very into deflecting any feedback that's coming our way because listening to things that problems that people have with us or or hearing about how we've disappointed somebody or hearing kind of what is wrong with us it really hurts our feelings. Everybody.
I mean, everybody feels this way. I don't I mean, if you're a person that never gets your feelings hurt by feeling getting feedback, call me up. Tell me your secret. But what I wanna talk about today is this idea about this defensiveness that we all experience that prevents us from being able to, like, hear what's being said and see what is happening in our relationships and what the people that we're in relationships actually need from us. Which is basically that they wanna get closer.
Right? We don't bring things up with people because we wanna create distance in our relationship. We bring things up with people because we want to get closer. And so, you know, I sort of laugh, tongue, and cheek, you know, when you're married, you just you get into arguments. Right?
When you're in friendships, you don't always agree And certainly, when you're parenting, right, you get feedback that's not very comfortable sometimes. And so do kids And when we defend, we cannot hear. And when we defend, we cannot improve. And so if you wanna have close relationships in which there's a give and a take and good communication, and we're always kinda working to make things better, defensiveness has to go. Defensiveness is effectively putting a shield in front of you made of steel.
And when we have our shields up, no one can get in. So it doesn't help to improve relationships or to bring us closer. It really just deflects people. You know, I wanna talk about this because when we can't connect, we don't feel good, my friends. We feel sad.
We feel lonely. We feel unseen and not validated. Right? And so when we can't connect, we aren't We aren't joined with the people in our lives, and defensiveness literally prevents connection. We do all kinds of stuff in our defensiveness that actually does long term damage to relationships.
I've sat in this room with a lot of people and talked about relationships and how we connect and how we disconnect. And what I'll tell you is that defensiveness is one of the main things that I see as a barrier to people being able to be connected in a way that they feel is fulfilling. So, you know, when we are always holding a shield, and then sometimes defensiveness can be a sword too. Right? Because me, myself, I tend to very quickly put up my shield so that I'm not so that my feelings don't get hurt by the feedback that's coming my way.
But also I hold a sword at the ready in case I need to give a good poke. Do you have a shield and a sword Right? How are we gonna connect when we both are holding shields and swords? In order to connect, we must be open. Which is vulnerable.
And for some of us, that can be really scary. But I wanna dream for a moment about what would relationships be like if people weren't so defensive? Right? What would it be like if we had an easy, breezy dialogue where we can be open to feedback, give feedback, be really intentional in our relationships with each other. And learn to kind of see feedback in the relationship as as, like, growth work, not hurtful.
Right? Feedback would be a way to get closer as opposed to kind of this idea of, like, and now we're gonna sit down and talk about our relationship and and who's gonna get their shield out first and who's gonna get their sword out first. Right? And and I will say, not every bit of feedback is something we need to modify our behavior around. Okay?
So just because somebody has an you with how you are in a relationship. It it actually doesn't mean that you have to change in any way. That's your choice. Maybe you decide you don't actually want to change what's being told to you because you're not ready to or you don't think it's an issue, maybe that relationship just ends up not being a good fit for you. Right?
But, see, here's the funny thing about relationships is that when we get into any kind of relationship with the person, we have to understand that they're not like us. They don't perceive the world like us. They don't like things the same as us. They don't feel the same feelings at the same times that we feel. If we're not open to the fact that we're very, very, very different, we can have a lot of problems we can have a lot of problems relating.
You know, we use the word relating, but what it means is like, we understand each other. We're willing to let somebody else be who they are, and we're gonna be who we are, and we're gonna make room for each other. In the relationship. So let's talk about things what we can do about, like, defensiveness. So First, I wanna talk about, like, when you feel defensive and what you can do about that.
You know, sometimes it's like, we get feedback all the time. We get it through, you know, our kids' teachers or we get it through work or we get it through our spouse. Sometimes we get it out in the world. Sometimes we get it from our children. Sometimes we get it from our friends.
Right? So there's a lot of feedback coming our way, and it would be easy to think to yourself like, I just don't I'm not good at relationships. Right? And so an easier thing to do is just take feedback as information and then you can decide what to do with that information. The other thing is and I always laugh.
You know, there's a lot of laugh in my therapy office because I'm able to kind of look at life and see that it's funny when other people aren't. But, you know, we always think like, oh, we're gonna sit down and we're gonna talk about this. Like, listen, that's not a one conversation thing. So if you're having a conflict with your spouse or a friend or someone in your family, understand that instead of one conversation, difficult topics are multiple. Conversations.
So your responsibility as a grown up or as a person in general is just to, like, be willing And I could do a whole podcast episode on this idea of just being willing. Right? But we don't want it. We don't wanna have conflict. We don't wanna have serious conversations.
It it prevents us from listening, and it prevents us from speaking. So what I would say is like, be accountable in your relationships, like be willing to have difficult conversations. Those are those are the only area that we can grow from. Right? And so, you know, a lot of people talk about, let's just be happy.
Like, let's see what's good, and I say, absolutely. Yes. Do that. And also, be willing to have regular conversations about areas that could be improved. Okay?
And you know, what's really important is that when you're getting ready to have a difficult conversation, you have to be accountable to your body. As well by breathing. So one thing that tends to happen when we get into what we perceive as a difficult conversation, even if it's just like, hey, can we figure out kinda what to do about the recycling situation in the garage? First, just an example off the top of my head. We get all elevated.
Right? And so that not helpful and leads us right to pulling out our shield and our sword. So when I say breathe, I'm not just giving you this cliche answer about, like, yeah, you should totally breathe all the time. Like, duh, you're breathing right now. What I'm saying is, like, when you're having difficult conversations, you need to be monitoring your nervous system and your breathing system to make sure that you're not entering into a fight or flight mode because fight or flight modes when we get out the shield and the sword.
Okay? And no connection and no listening and nothing good happens there. So take responsibility to keep your system calm when you're having important conversations with people you care about. And and, you know, the other thing that I would say is, like, always focus on content, not delivery, and not always, but, like, when a conversation comes up for the first time, focus on the content, not the delivery for now because the delivery is a project for another time. That's what I would say.
Right? But one of the things that leads us into defensiveness is when the delivery sucks. We get so wrapped up in like, how can you talk to me like that? And how how dare you treat me this way? When really what the content is underneath it all is this kind of vulnerability in wanting to connect better typically.
Pay attention. Be open to hearing what the feedback is underneath the delivery. Right? And if you tend to get defensive, then I would say, just be quiet. Right?
And listen to kind of what's going on in your mind because typically when we're getting feedback, we either deny it, we justify it, or we turn that shit around on the other person, which I can do like champ in case you ever need instructions for that. So denying, justifying, and blaming. Those things are also signs that the shield and the sword is out, and there's not gonna be any connection. So if you find that that's what happening, step back from that and and pause and get your system calm, ask for a break if you need one. Right?
Not every conversation has to end in solution. Meaning, again, not every conversation is a one conversation deal. Right? In our house, if we're trying to work out some sort of conflict, whether it's about the dishes or the deeper meaning of our relationship. We have a full understanding that it's gonna be a many conversation.
Thing. It's like a a mini series. Right? I mean, wouldn't you rather have many shorter, more emotionally regulated conversations than the knock down drag out. I cannot stand the knock down drag out.
I've gotten so tired of the knock down drag out. Like, I can't sit for three hours. With the crying and the clinics and the defensiveness and the shields and the sewers and the love and the connection and then the sewers. It's a whole thing. Right?
I don't wanna do that anymore. So what I've realized in my own life and in my work is that it's it's much better for our bodies and our brains to just chunk that stuff up a little bit. It's it can be a longer conversation. So quickly, I wanna say, like, if you have a partner that tends to be defensive, which, you know, again, like, defensiveness is a human thing, not a specific trade for specific people. But what I would say is that you can learn to talk with your partner in a different way.
Like, if you know that they get really triggered and get defensive, then there's a different way that you could talk with them that maybe wouldn't ignite that part, that, you know, sort of, wounded part of who they are. Learn to talk about relationships from an I perspective, not a u perspective. And we we talk about this a lot and again, I can I could go on and on about it? But do some work here. Discover what you need and ask for that.
Right? I want I need to be, you know, asked how I'm feeling I need to be checked in with regularly. I need more snuggles. Right? Or I need help around the house and here is what I need specifically.
Right? The other thing is just be willing to to call out your your own and your partner's defensiveness and be and be willing to course correct, meaning, like, I can see that you're getting defensive, and I don't I'm not trying to put you in the position of feeling like you need to defend yourself. I'm trying to create connection. So let's course correct. Meaning, there's always that chance to start again.
Right? There's always that chance to pause. So the other thing is, and then this is a skill to cultivate for every situation in in I I never can think of a situation in which open ended questions are not are a great idea. Okay? So ask open ended questions.
Instead of saying, well, this is how it is, and this is this, and this is blah blah. What about just saying, can we come up with a different way to communicate about the kids? Or can we come up with a different way to share the dishes in the evening? Can we come up with a different bedtime routine? Right?
I'm feeling disconnected. How can we connect in a way that we can both feel good? That's an open ended question. An open ended question is basically a question for which you haven't already got a pre planned answer, my friend. It's a vulnerable question.
It means open. Anything goes, baby. You might hear something that you never expected to hear. If we're open, we can move into some different territory in our relationships. If we're always holding our shield and our sword, there's only one way that things can go, and that's a fight.
Right? So in order to deal with the responsiveness. I think the biggest thing I wanna say today to you is just be willing to be vulnerable. Be willing to talk about hard stuff. Be willing to lower the shield.
Be willing to see somebody else's shield as a wound and help them feel safe to lower their shield. Be willing to learn how to communicate in a totally different way. You know, in my house when we get into defensiveness, which John and I are both can be very defensive. What we do is we just sort of like step back and and state the overarching purpose of the conversation. For example, when you're married to a therapist, the overarching conversation is like, I want to be connected.
And I'm trying to figure out how we can be better connected And I really think that that translates to everyone. We all really want to be connected. So if you just go back to the overarching purpose of the conversation and be willing to come back to it. And so again, like, It's not one conversation. If there's defensiveness, that means the conversation has gone in the wrong direction.
And we need a course correct or the conversation needs to be started over another time. Just be willing. Be willing to be vulnerable. Be open to learning, and we can all get closer in our relationships. Isn't that what we're after?
Right? So are you do you get defensive? Is that something that is worth taking a look at? And how does it impact your relationships? Keep your eyes peeled for yourself.
My friends. So many times when we listen to self help things or, you know, like mental health tips or whatever. We think about how those can be applied to the people in our lives that are driving us crazy. And what I would say is just look inward. That's what this podcast is here to help you do.
Continue to look inward. Continue to do your own work. And I my friend will be here with you because I'm doing the work too. We'll get that recycling in the garage taken care of one way or the other. Euny.
Susan. Thanks so much for listening to Takeout Therapy. Please forward the podcast along to a friend or take the time to write a short review. That way more people have access to what's essentially free mental health help guys. I'd love to connect with you.
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And of course, I always welcome questions or suggestions. For those of you who have interest in working with me, I specialize in helping people get rid of dysfunctional levels of stress, both through my online classes or in person work. Come check out my website at rebekah hunter m s w dot com. Okay. Thanks for playing.
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